I don't think it's impossible to satirize something you have contempt for, such as superhero movies in the case of The Franchise. But the people most likely to get the jokes are the people who have watched all the superhero movies and are therefore probably fans.
I wonder if it would have been better to take the approach of something like Galaxy Quest--it hits all the targets and makes fun of all the tropes of Star Trek but clearly is made with affection for the original.
I'm looking forward to The Franchise. While I've seen most of the Marvel movies, only a few of them have been particularly entertaining to me and the endless proliferation and "universe building" has become really tiresome and so contempt seems fine to me. I think Alan is a bigger fan of the films and maybe a bit less susceptible to the satire.
I'd suggest that Amazon Prime's The Boys was essentially a satire of the entire genre, made by people who clearly loved the genre. Or at least it started out that way. But it's become so enamored of gratuitous gore, bathroom humor, and 4chan-level sex jokes that it no longer resembles much of anything in the genre (on top of rarely being funny).
Kristen Bell not knowing what shalom (and other common Yiddish words) meant was insane! But it’s part of my problem with the show - they are 35-40ish and act like they are 25. It’s not cute to be that clueless when you’re a dead ass adult. Also, her sister lives in that house but doesn’t own a vase? It was a little silly in those parts. I also found Noah condescending at time when he was supposed to be being understanding. All that said, I thoroughly enjoyed the show and I’m looking forward to a second season!
We discussed the show during Rosh Hashanah dinner. The woman were unhappy with how the Jewish women were portrayed and I said you cannot live in Los Angeles not knowing what a Bar Mitzvah is (if you’ve never been to one you’ve seen one in a movie) or what Shabbat is or means. It’s still a good show.
Yeah, I softened on Esther, but it was rough going there at the beginning with the Jewish stereotypical mom/girlfriend/sister-in-law trifecta of shrill, overbearing and conniving.
Re: the lack of Jewish understanding - I can tell you that it's been great for me and my wife as a learning experience. We live in Ireland, which as of 2018, had a 0.05% Jewish population and there are only 5 synagogues in the whole country. The only Jewish folks I've ever properly met were work colleagues when the company I worked at had US offices. Not exactly the right environment to ask questions.
Only Catholicism is taught in most schools (if any religion is at all).
So, basically, as a nation, we're largely ignorant of Judaism and Jewish culture in general. Hopefully, through the show, more people over here will learn more about our Jewish neighbours, brothers and sisters, at least.
What was more unbelievable than Kristen Bell’s character not knowing much about Judaism, which did not seem that crazy to me, was how her age was not mentioned or even an issue. Both of the actors are in their 40s and I think courtship at that age has a different character. Wouldn’t his traditional Jewish mother be more concerned how they could not have children together than whatever her religion is?
That's a great story about The Wire kids. And at that point, season 18 and the show was still broadcast in classic 4:3 fullscreen mode. Meaning the show now has almost as many episodes made for widescreen as the first 400 episodes or so made in the old aspect ratio.
I think the Simpsons are kind of like U2; amazing early years, hit a creative and commercial peak impossible to sustain, then hung around so long that we take them for granted.
On "NWT", I was fairly pleased with the portrayal of modern Angeleno Judaism. There were just as many 'positive' stereotypes as "negative" ones (i.e. his father to his mother) and even the presumed harpies got 3-Dimensionalized in the full season. As a current dater, there wasn't anything off about the level of "general knowledge from the zeitgeist" that shiksas have (and this is in L.A., in the entertainment industry! Not 'everyone; knows about your (our) own cultural and religious customs, and believing that they do or should is very myopic.)
RE The Simpsons, which I admit I've cherished for 38 years, the only 2 notes I'd add are that:
1) while your "previous Series Finale conceptuals" idea is fun, the major missed facet of that episode that I haven't seen ANYONE make yet is that this episode was the first one in all 36 seasons to have been ACTUALLY CONCEIVED AND PRODUCED as a SEASON PREMIERE. They have literally never cared to produce a 'season premiere' before. The SERIES premiere was selected as such because the real 'debut episode' needed to be entirely re-animated. Every single other season premiere has been chosen as such because it has been the *production series holdover* out of a bunch (seven, for the last 20+ seasons) that they and the network feel is the "most-promotion-friendly", due to a guest star or a 'big, landmark' plot. This one was truly planned by Selman to BE a/the Season Premiere, with ruminations on the show's longevity & adjustments themselves, and it was a brilliant "first" for the show, dressed up deceivingly as a "last".
2) That Scully-period drop-off having a signature "Jerk Ass Homer" feature was always an overblown ruse. Homer had already had the "irrational angry drive" mode inherent to his personality in the early. bedrock "When Flanders Failed", and it was really honed and explored first in - well, whaddaya know? - the Conan O'Brien-penned "Homer Goes To College". He wasn't overwhelmingly "angry" over the Scully period, and we still see it in episodes since just as much in the latter Al seasons. No, the only real 'boring, repetitive' Scully issues that marked his time was an over-reliance on "surprise/twist" endings, which became depressingly routine and sitcom-my, and a weird navel-gazing obsession with 'show-biz' related & motivated plots, which made the shows far more sour that sweet.
I like your Ephron scripting Star Trek analogy with Curtis writing Doctor Who. Curious as to whether it’s a hit with your family. The Van Gogh episode is still the one I watch most often as a comfort watch. As with everything Who it has some flaws but the combo of the Doctor Amy and Van Gogh and the actors who played them were one of the best groups ever. Particularly enjoyed the Bill Nighy cameo and Doctor interactions. Are bow ties cool yet?
Oh, they like modern Who, though so far, the Moffat era has been less enthusiastically received than the RTD years. And "Vincent and the Doctor" was a big hit.
Glad to hear. May be something to the first Doctor is your Doctor. Came to Who as a habit with Smith. But also partial to Capaldi as I’m old. But understand the Moffat enthusiasm. As I said I’m old and probably more forgiving (or even at the time) blind to some of his faults. Hope they enjoy the anniversary special with Smith and Tenant.
Of course, it's worth noting that Curtis has *deep* TV roots in England. He wrote for "Not the Nine O'Clock News" and "The Vicar of Dibly" (among others), and co-created both "Blackadder" and "Mr. Bean".
It was a bad week for COMING 2 AMERICA cameos: first Dikembe Mutombo, now John Amos. (And James Earl Jones earlier in September, obviously.) It looks like Colin Jost, Gladys Knight, and Salt-N-Pepa have survived the week, however.
I really liked "Nobody Wants This" overall, particularly the rom-com story, Adam and Kristen's chemistry, and their comedy. But I was really bothered by the stereotypical portrayal of Jewish women. There have been a lot of great articles over the last week diving into this, which I've collected and will be sharing in the next edition of my newsletter on Tuesday.
Tarantino directed episodes of CSI and ER, but did not write them. And in this case, it was Curtis going out of his genre, to write about time travel and an invisible monster.
It won’t air till the new year but it was exciting to hear about the confirmation of Abbott/Sunny crossover. I think this might the first time a broadcast & cable show are doing a crossover while both still on the air.
(David Marciano reprised his role as Det. Billings twice on SWAT but that was well after The Shield ended.)
Richard Belzer's brief cameo as Detective Munch on The Wire S5 coincided with his recurring appearances on SVU (specifically S10, I believe). But the cameo is very brief and has really nothing to do with SVU so not sure it counts relative to the other cross-over.
Even as a kid of ~6 years old, I was mesmerized by John Amos in Good Times and Roots. I recall the powerful, dissonant image of him sitting in Archie Bunker’s place, as it were, in 704 Hauser too (fracturing the Norman Lear Cinematic Universe). You’re right about the “casting trap” he found himself in, but I was just glad to see him pop up whenever he did.
I don't think it's impossible to satirize something you have contempt for, such as superhero movies in the case of The Franchise. But the people most likely to get the jokes are the people who have watched all the superhero movies and are therefore probably fans.
I wonder if it would have been better to take the approach of something like Galaxy Quest--it hits all the targets and makes fun of all the tropes of Star Trek but clearly is made with affection for the original.
I'm looking forward to The Franchise. While I've seen most of the Marvel movies, only a few of them have been particularly entertaining to me and the endless proliferation and "universe building" has become really tiresome and so contempt seems fine to me. I think Alan is a bigger fan of the films and maybe a bit less susceptible to the satire.
I'd suggest that Amazon Prime's The Boys was essentially a satire of the entire genre, made by people who clearly loved the genre. Or at least it started out that way. But it's become so enamored of gratuitous gore, bathroom humor, and 4chan-level sex jokes that it no longer resembles much of anything in the genre (on top of rarely being funny).
Kristen Bell not knowing what shalom (and other common Yiddish words) meant was insane! But it’s part of my problem with the show - they are 35-40ish and act like they are 25. It’s not cute to be that clueless when you’re a dead ass adult. Also, her sister lives in that house but doesn’t own a vase? It was a little silly in those parts. I also found Noah condescending at time when he was supposed to be being understanding. All that said, I thoroughly enjoyed the show and I’m looking forward to a second season!
We discussed the show during Rosh Hashanah dinner. The woman were unhappy with how the Jewish women were portrayed and I said you cannot live in Los Angeles not knowing what a Bar Mitzvah is (if you’ve never been to one you’ve seen one in a movie) or what Shabbat is or means. It’s still a good show.
Yeah, I softened on Esther, but it was rough going there at the beginning with the Jewish stereotypical mom/girlfriend/sister-in-law trifecta of shrill, overbearing and conniving.
Re: the lack of Jewish understanding - I can tell you that it's been great for me and my wife as a learning experience. We live in Ireland, which as of 2018, had a 0.05% Jewish population and there are only 5 synagogues in the whole country. The only Jewish folks I've ever properly met were work colleagues when the company I worked at had US offices. Not exactly the right environment to ask questions.
Only Catholicism is taught in most schools (if any religion is at all).
So, basically, as a nation, we're largely ignorant of Judaism and Jewish culture in general. Hopefully, through the show, more people over here will learn more about our Jewish neighbours, brothers and sisters, at least.
What was more unbelievable than Kristen Bell’s character not knowing much about Judaism, which did not seem that crazy to me, was how her age was not mentioned or even an issue. Both of the actors are in their 40s and I think courtship at that age has a different character. Wouldn’t his traditional Jewish mother be more concerned how they could not have children together than whatever her religion is?
They are both supposed to be playing younger, but there is no overt reference to that. I wouldn’t know if they hadn’t mentioned it in our interview.
That's a great story about The Wire kids. And at that point, season 18 and the show was still broadcast in classic 4:3 fullscreen mode. Meaning the show now has almost as many episodes made for widescreen as the first 400 episodes or so made in the old aspect ratio.
I think the Simpsons are kind of like U2; amazing early years, hit a creative and commercial peak impossible to sustain, then hung around so long that we take them for granted.
On "NWT", I was fairly pleased with the portrayal of modern Angeleno Judaism. There were just as many 'positive' stereotypes as "negative" ones (i.e. his father to his mother) and even the presumed harpies got 3-Dimensionalized in the full season. As a current dater, there wasn't anything off about the level of "general knowledge from the zeitgeist" that shiksas have (and this is in L.A., in the entertainment industry! Not 'everyone; knows about your (our) own cultural and religious customs, and believing that they do or should is very myopic.)
RE The Simpsons, which I admit I've cherished for 38 years, the only 2 notes I'd add are that:
1) while your "previous Series Finale conceptuals" idea is fun, the major missed facet of that episode that I haven't seen ANYONE make yet is that this episode was the first one in all 36 seasons to have been ACTUALLY CONCEIVED AND PRODUCED as a SEASON PREMIERE. They have literally never cared to produce a 'season premiere' before. The SERIES premiere was selected as such because the real 'debut episode' needed to be entirely re-animated. Every single other season premiere has been chosen as such because it has been the *production series holdover* out of a bunch (seven, for the last 20+ seasons) that they and the network feel is the "most-promotion-friendly", due to a guest star or a 'big, landmark' plot. This one was truly planned by Selman to BE a/the Season Premiere, with ruminations on the show's longevity & adjustments themselves, and it was a brilliant "first" for the show, dressed up deceivingly as a "last".
2) That Scully-period drop-off having a signature "Jerk Ass Homer" feature was always an overblown ruse. Homer had already had the "irrational angry drive" mode inherent to his personality in the early. bedrock "When Flanders Failed", and it was really honed and explored first in - well, whaddaya know? - the Conan O'Brien-penned "Homer Goes To College". He wasn't overwhelmingly "angry" over the Scully period, and we still see it in episodes since just as much in the latter Al seasons. No, the only real 'boring, repetitive' Scully issues that marked his time was an over-reliance on "surprise/twist" endings, which became depressingly routine and sitcom-my, and a weird navel-gazing obsession with 'show-biz' related & motivated plots, which made the shows far more sour that sweet.
I like your Ephron scripting Star Trek analogy with Curtis writing Doctor Who. Curious as to whether it’s a hit with your family. The Van Gogh episode is still the one I watch most often as a comfort watch. As with everything Who it has some flaws but the combo of the Doctor Amy and Van Gogh and the actors who played them were one of the best groups ever. Particularly enjoyed the Bill Nighy cameo and Doctor interactions. Are bow ties cool yet?
Oh, they like modern Who, though so far, the Moffat era has been less enthusiastically received than the RTD years. And "Vincent and the Doctor" was a big hit.
Glad to hear. May be something to the first Doctor is your Doctor. Came to Who as a habit with Smith. But also partial to Capaldi as I’m old. But understand the Moffat enthusiasm. As I said I’m old and probably more forgiving (or even at the time) blind to some of his faults. Hope they enjoy the anniversary special with Smith and Tenant.
What about when David Mamet wrote an episode of Hill Street Blues? He’s done TV since, but that was quite a novelty at the time.
My Doctor was Tom Baker.
Of course, it's worth noting that Curtis has *deep* TV roots in England. He wrote for "Not the Nine O'Clock News" and "The Vicar of Dibly" (among others), and co-created both "Blackadder" and "Mr. Bean".
It was a bad week for COMING 2 AMERICA cameos: first Dikembe Mutombo, now John Amos. (And James Earl Jones earlier in September, obviously.) It looks like Colin Jost, Gladys Knight, and Salt-N-Pepa have survived the week, however.
Glad you're finally going to watch the Capaldi era.
I really liked "Nobody Wants This" overall, particularly the rom-com story, Adam and Kristen's chemistry, and their comedy. But I was really bothered by the stereotypical portrayal of Jewish women. There have been a lot of great articles over the last week diving into this, which I've collected and will be sharing in the next edition of my newsletter on Tuesday.
"what would be the American equivalent of when Richard Curtis guest-wrote an episode where the Doctor met Vincent Van Gogh?"
Are you asking what the equivalent would be of a big name writer writing in their genre for a tv show? Didn't Quentin Tarantino write a CSI episode?
Tarantino directed episodes of CSI and ER, but did not write them. And in this case, it was Curtis going out of his genre, to write about time travel and an invisible monster.
It won’t air till the new year but it was exciting to hear about the confirmation of Abbott/Sunny crossover. I think this might the first time a broadcast & cable show are doing a crossover while both still on the air.
(David Marciano reprised his role as Det. Billings twice on SWAT but that was well after The Shield ended.)
Richard Belzer's brief cameo as Detective Munch on The Wire S5 coincided with his recurring appearances on SVU (specifically S10, I believe). But the cameo is very brief and has really nothing to do with SVU so not sure it counts relative to the other cross-over.
Even as a kid of ~6 years old, I was mesmerized by John Amos in Good Times and Roots. I recall the powerful, dissonant image of him sitting in Archie Bunker’s place, as it were, in 704 Hauser too (fracturing the Norman Lear Cinematic Universe). You’re right about the “casting trap” he found himself in, but I was just glad to see him pop up whenever he did.
Hi Alan, Industry wrapped up an excellent 3rd season this week. I know you were positive on the 1st season but have you kept up with it?
I haven’t. For whatever reason, I wasn’t in them mood when s2 started, and then it just piled up. Maybe during the hiatus before season 4?